Logic Tips and Tricks

This page is intended to clarify some knowledge about how the fill places items and notable logic useful for many playthroughs. Tips are provided in no particular order, but are grouped by level. Information relevant (but not necessarily exclusive) to Season 3.5 will is tagged.

Terminology

Some terminology is commonly used in randomizer discussion. Some definitions and examples should help clarify intent in the language used in the tips and tricks below.

• "The fill" - This refers to the algorithm that places items in locations randomly. When the fill "expects" something, it means that it is anticipating you have access to that something before further items can be placed. For example, if the fill is "expecting" you to have Coconut Gun, then anything depending on that expectation cannot be placed without you also having access to Coconut Gun.
  Fill expectations are only expectations, NOT requirements. You don't HAVE to get Coconut Gun before anything that "expects" you to have it. Fill expectations have no impact on items required to beat seeds.
• "Logic" - This refers to the various requirements to reach locations and areas. For example, the logic expects you to have Coconut Gun to enter the Power Hut in Factory. The logic is flexible based on settings and may change those requirements based on activated glitch logic, entrance randomizers, location randomizers, and more.
  Logic requirements, unlike fill expectations, are hard requirements. You will be logically required to have Coconut Gun to enter the Power Hut (barring glitches, etc.) and if something is "logically required to beat the seed," that's where this comes from.
• "Level order is/isn't important" - The importance of level order affects several critical fill expectations and logic requirements.
  Level order is important in Vanilla level order and Simple Level Order Rando.
  Level order is NOT important in both Coupled and Decoupled Loading Zone Randomizers as well as Complex Level Order seeds.
  In S3.5, level order is NOT important. S3.5 uses Complex Level Order.
• "LZR" - Stands for Loading Zone Randomizer. It also includes both Coupled and Decoupled settings unless specified.
• "FTA" - Stands for Free Trade Agreement. This is the setting that enables Kongs to pick up other Kongs' major collectibles. Logic does account for this setting being enabled!

Global

• (S3.5) If you enter Snide's with a Kong without any blueprints, Snide will reveal the Kongs required (in order) to shut down the Blast-O-Matic.

• (S3.5) Cranky will tell you whether or not the item on the Jetpac game is foolish. See All About Hints for more details on the definition of "foolish".

• If level order is important, the fill places items in such a way to guarantee a certain number of Kongs by each level. The fill expects:

  • 2 Kongs before entering level 3
  • 3 Kongs before entering level 4
  • 4 Kongs before entering level 5
  • 5 Kongs before entering level 6

  For example, you cannot find any item that would lock your 4th Kong in level 5 or beyond. Levels 4 and earlier are fair game.

• If level order is important, the fill places Barrels, Vines, and Diving (not Oranges!) expecting you to have them BEFORE entering level 4.
  This can include level 4's lobby in some circumstances.

• (S3.5) The fill expects you to have 1.2 times the number of fairies required, rounded down, to reach the Rareware GB location. Basically, you have a small buffer on fairies that you may choose acquire.

• (S3.5) The fill expects you to have 1.2 times the number of medals required, rounded down, to reach the Rareware Coin location on Jetpac. This functions the same as above.

• The logic does take into account gravity affecting some rewards from automatically completed bonus barrels. Any barrel that drops their item does not require you to have to be able to reach the original barrel's location in the first place.

• (S3.5) The fill chooses completely random starting moves, independent of what Kongs you start with. This may or may not help your early progression, but the fill doesn't care.

• In LZR (mostly), you may be expected to use the Exit Level option on the pause menu. This will take you to the exit that you would normally reach by exiting the level portal. Some maps (notably most races) will only exit you to the entrance you came from.

• In LZR (mostly), you may be expected to die to return to the start of the level. Not all maps allow this (notably Japes Underground) but it is often crucial in 5-Door Temple rooms or the Factory Crusher room.

• (S3.5) Tag Anywhere is NEVER in logic for anything. If you tag Kongs somewhere without tag barrel access, you are bypassing logical requirements. This tends to happen often when compensating for not owning the guns or instruments you otherwise need in the moment.

• (S3.5) Some settings (most notably Kasplat location shuffle) can place Kasplats in water shallow enough their heads peek above the surface. These Kasplats are in logic with no additional items if you can reach them, as jumping on their heads kills them. The most notorious example of this is eligible in Season 3: the Galleon Lighthouse Alcove Kasplat, also known as Kevin.

Bonus Barrels

• (S3.5) The Donkey Blast Helm minigame does require Baboon Blast! This is settings-dependent on the "Balanced Phases" setting (which is enabled in Season 3)
• (S3.5) The switch in the Lanky Sprint Helm minigame requires you to be in Orangstand Sprint to press it. Therefore, this game now always requires Sprint.
• (S3.5) The Chunky Helm shooting minigame logically requires Homing, Sniper, or the hard shooting setting to deal with potentially troublesome enemies that hide behind boxes.
• Some Mad Maze Mauls have logical requirements due to the enemies contained within.
  • The 120 second Mad Maze Maul logically requires the barrel's Kong's gun and either Shockwave or Oranges.
  • The 125 second Mad Maze Maul logically requires the barrel's Kong's gun.

Bosses

• (S3.5) Dogadon 2 does NOT require Primate Punch. Standard B punches also damage him while you are Hunky Chunky.
• If level order is important, bosses are placed in such a way as to guarantee they are beatable (but not necessarily reachable!) in logic with moves in or before their level. This means you can use boss placement to read the placement of specific items:
  • Hunky Chunky is always placed in or before the level that Dogadon 2 appears.
  • Twirl is always placed in or before the level that Mad Jack appears (in non-hard bosses).
  • Barrels is always placed in or before the level of the first barrels-required boss.
  • Finding a K. Rool phase on a level's T&S would enforce the location of the phase-required moves to be in that level or earlier.
  • If the Guitar door is closed and the Aztec T&S is suspiciously cheap, it is likely that one of Guitar or Diddy is placed after Aztec and locking the majority of CBs. This one is a little trickier to read as it's not a guarantee unless it's blatant.
  • If your Shipyard or Lighthouse gates are closed in Galleon, and the T&S there is suspiciously cheap, it is possible one or both of the area-locking guns is in a later level. This is similar to Aztec's Guitar, but even harder to read.

DK Isles

• (S3.5) Diddy's Peanut Cage above the waterfall logically requires the Rocketbarrel barrel to be spawned and used. This makes the location logically require significantly more things than you might expect at first glance. At a minimum, Barrels, Trombone, Rocketbarrel, and Peanut are all required.
• One of Donkey, Chunky, or Tiny + Twirl is logically required to reach the ear of DK Isle to enter lobby 6. This is often relevant in Complex Level Order seeds and LZR.
• The Krem Isle Mouth only opens once you have Keys 6 and 7. If you exit from that entrance (most often in LZR), you will drop and splat on the W4 level unless you have those Keys. The logic knows this, so in that scenario the top level of Krem Isle is logically inaccessible until you own those Keys.

Jungle Japes

• (S3.5) In Kong Rando, the fill assigns a Kong to be the Diddy-freeing-Kong. This changes what the location's Kong is for the purposes of hints. A "Diddy finds Chunky in Jungle Japes" hint could have Chunky on the item in front of the Kong cage if Diddy is the Diddy-freeing-Kong.
• The back of Japes only opens when you acquire the reward inside the Kong cage atop the hillside. The logic knows what requirements are necessary for this. This includes:
  • Whether or not there is even a Kong in the cage to be freed. Without a Kong in the cage, the cage is already open and the item can be freely run into.
  • Whether or not FTA is on for the item in the cage. Without FTA enabled, you would be forced to go find the Diddy-freeing-Kong to pick up the item.
• (S3.5) The dirt patch on the hill to the painting room logically requires one of Lanky + Orangstand OR Tiny + Twirl.
• (S3.5) Entering the Japes minecart logically requires Chimpy Charge and that level's Slam requirement to slow down the conveyors and open the gate.
  (Advanced Platforming can expect you to jump around the gate, bypassing the Charge but not the Slam requirement)
• (S3.5) The Tiny Shellhive logically requires one of Saxophone or Oranges due to the strong, very large enemies that can prevent you from slamming the switches.
• (S3.5) Vines is logically required to reach the Troff 'N' Scoff alcove above the right-most tunnel. You can jump down from above with careful kicks, but this is not particularly intuitive and only considered in Advanced Platforming logic. Logical access to T&S's in Japes is tricky, so watch out for one of your requirements (Vines, Peanut, Coconut).
• In Japes Diddy Mountain, hitting the Peanut Switch is logically required to reach the slam switch. With Advanced Platforming, Diddy can instead jump across the gap or backflip up. This is generally only relevant in LZR, where you might not already have the gun.

Angry Aztec

• (S3.5) Similar to the Diddy-freeing-Kong scenario (see Jungle Japes), the Tiny and Lanky cages work the same way.
• (S3.5) The Kasplat past the Coconut gate on the sandy bridge logically requires one of Donkey + Strong Kong OR Tiny + Twirl.
• The Guitar pad to open the back of Aztec logically requires both Climbing and one of either Rocketbarrel or Vines to reach it. Unlike the abilities needed to enter the level at all, this requirement is NOT assumed by the hints! See the All About Hints page for details on hint assumptions.
• (S3.5) While you can tactically Chimpy Charge to charge onto the Gong Tower as it rises, the Aztec Diddy Ram Gongs location (and the subsequent Beetle Race) always logically requires Rocketbarrel in case you did not do so.
• (S3.5) The most notorious piece of Tag Anywhere logic is the Tiny Temple. It is easy to access with any of the four guns, but each Kong logically requires their gun for anything they do inside the Tiny Temple. For example, Feather is always logically required for Aztec Tiny Klaptrap Room.
• (S3.5) Candy's shop in Aztec does not require Vines to access. The quicksand gap is narrow enough near the Tiny Temple side for anyone to jump across.

Frantic Factory

• (S3.5) Similar to the Diddy-freeing-Kong scenario (see Jungle Japes), the Chunky cage works the same way.
• (S3.5) The switches at the bottom of the Production Room are required to spawn the corresponding check above. The vanilla game has some of the items pre-spawned, but the randomizer enforces the slamming of the switches.
• (S3.5) With Faster Checks enabled for Factory Arcade Round 1, the GB normally found in the DK Arcade is instead placed on the Blast Course. Picking up the GB spawns the lever for the Blast Course, and Round 2 for the Nintendo Coin becomes the first level played there.

Gloomy Galleon

• In LZR, you may exit from an entrance already swimming underwater. This means you then have logical access to everything underwater in that area. "Diving" according to the logic is the ability to press Z to go from surface swimming to underwater swimming. By already being underwater from exiting an underwater entrance, you can bypass that requirement.
• (S3.5) Troff 'N' Scoff portals in this level are in inconvenient locations. You logically need at least one of Vines or Diving to reach any.
• Raised water (which may lead to a Diving requirement if it did not start this way) is logically required for a number of jumps:
  • Hitting the DK Star to open the Treasure Room
  • Reaching the Lighthouse platform
  • Reaching the Cannon Game platforms
  • Reaching the Snide Alcove
  • Entering the Seal Race

Fungi Forest

• (S3.5) The Day/Night switches logically require guns to activate. You can also use Oranges, but because this is uncommon knowledge it is not part of the logic.
• (S3.5) Climbing the interior of the giant mushroom does NOT logically require Vines. The single-vine gap can be jumped. Note that the night-locked door does logically require Vines to reach from the inside.
• (S3.5) There are no logical requirements to drop down from the exterior top floor of the giant mushroom to the upper platform with the Kasplat or the platform with the Battle Arena, regardless of time of day.
• In LZR, every entrance in the Forest Mills is fair game to be shuffled. This includes every Mini Monkey entrance, including the normally-useless connector between the front of the mill and the back of the mill.
• (S3.5) The Lanky Shooting Attic logically requires Homing or the hard shooting setting (not enabled in Season 3).
• (S3.5) The dirt patch discovered beneath the grass in the mills area is a location that can have items. There is a miscellaneous setting (active in Season 3) that raises it slightly to make it visible.
• (S3.5) Forest Chunky Keg Crushing logically requires you to activate the conveyor belt with Donkey. This makes it require a substantial amount of moves that might not be immediately obvious. At a minimum you need enough Slam upgrades, Gorilla Grab, Primate Punch, Triangle, and Barrels.
  Chunky Keg Crushing only requires the crushing of 2 kegs to account for LZR seeds not being able to simply walk the third keg over.
• Outside of LZR, there are 3 ways to ascend the Giant Mushroom:
  • Climbing to climb ladders to the top
  • Rocketbarrel to fly straight to the top
  • All 5 guns to activate the cannons inside the Giant Mushroom to blast to the top
• If you have Dusk on, beware of the Spider Boss! Because of Tag Anywhere not being in logic, you need a Kong's corresponding gun to defeat the boss. This leads to a major either/or situation specifically in Dusk where either Feather + Mini OR Pineapple + Punch will be enough to logically beat the Spider Boss.
• If you die in the Spider Boss room, you will be placed in the back of the Mill outside the vanilla Spider Boss entrance. This is not shuffled in LZR!

Crystal Caves

• (S3.5) There is a Strong Kong barrel added to the Donkey Igloo. Because of that barrel, this location now logically requires Strong Kong.
• (S3.5) The Caves Donkey 5 Door Cabin logically requires Homing or the hard shooting setting.
• (S3.5) The Caves Diddy 5 Door Lower does logically require Rocketbarrel even though you can backflip up to a platform instead. It is not an easy cabin doing it this way, so the timer has been removed and the Rocketbarrel inside the cabin has been included in logic to assist.
• (S3.5) The Caves Tiny 5 Door Cabin and Caves Diddy 5 Door Cabin Lower locations each logically require Oranges and are two of the very few locations to always logically require Oranges.
• The Caves Diddy 5 Door Cabin Upper logically requires Guitar or Oranges. In non-LZR this is trivial, as the room already requires Guitar to enter.
• The Battle Arena in Donkey's Cabin requires Donkey because only he can slam the switches to rotate the room. This is only relevant in LZR.
• The T&S Doors in the Cabins Area have logical requirements. The door atop Donkey's Rotating Cabin requires Rocketbarrel. The door atop Lanky's Sprint Cabin requires either Rocketbarrel or Balloon.

Creepy Castle

• (S3.5) You are logically required to Monkeyport into the Museum to take the photo of the fairy there. It is possible (but not in logic) to take a photo of that fairy through the glass on Chunky's side of the Museum.
• (S3.5) Lanky's Tower logically requires Sniper. If Hard Shooting is enabled, you may have to do it with either Sniper or Homing. To hit the grape switches with Homing, you have to stand closer to the targeted switch's wall and let the homing shot carry the grape above your reticle.
• (S3.5) Despite the Sprint barrel inside, Lanky's Greenhouse does not logically require Sprint.
• (S3.5) Chunky's Shed can be completed by killing all the invisible enemies with either Triangle OR (Gorilla Gone + Pineapple). Both of these cases still logically require Primate Punch to open the box.
• (S3.5) The fairy inside the tree logically requires Diving. This is because it could be possible to softlock a seed by completing Donkey Tree Sniping, raising the water, and leaving (for whatever reason). You would then need Diving to get back to the fairy.
  The exit from that room also requires Diving for a similar reason - when the water is raised you need Diving to access it.

Hideout Helm and K. Rool

• The Helm Battle Arena (no matter where it is) always logically requires the Blast-O-Matic to be deactivated.
• (S3.5) You may be logically expected to Quit Game out of Helm and get a Game Over if you need to logically double-dip Helm.
• (S3.5) Donkey's K. Rool phase always requires Climbing to reach the Blast barrels. In addition, the phase may or may not require Baboon Blast, depending on the Balanced Phases setting. In Season 3, it does require Baboon Blast.
• (S3.5) Tiny's K. Rool phase logically requires Feather and Mini Monkey. You can also damage K. Rool's toes with Oranges. but this is not in logic. You do not need Twirl to jump over the shockwaves.
• (S3.5) Chunky's K. Rool phase may or may not require Super Simian Slam (blue slam), depending on the Balanced Phases setting. In Season 3, it does NOT require Super Simian Slam, only Simian Slam.
• If T&S Bosses can be a part of your final fight, the Kong you enter with will be the Kong you fight them with unless the fight has a Kong restriction (Mad Jack, Dogadon 2, any K. Rool Phase). There are no designated Kongs for fights without a Kong requirement.