Alert Expiration

[white3km]

Hello, I've been consuming active alerts for a bit and I just ran into an issue that I was wondering about. Basically in my code I had marked an alert as inactive since it was expired (and possibly at one time was not being returned from the active endpoint) but now that alert is being returned from the active alert endpoint even though it's expired.

Alert Id: urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.14c5d6e6998688e7e0f6e92c4d5de01f6dd3d51b.001.1
The current datetime is 5/2/2025 08:50:00 EST and the expires field is 2025-04-26T06:00:00-08:00 for the alert. There aren't any references listed but it seems that other alerts should be taking the place of this expired alert.

• Is this just a data error on NWS's side?
• Can expired alerts be returned from an active alert endpoint?
• If so, do you treat them as active alerts based on ends field?

Request:
https://api.weather.gov/alerts/active/zone/PKZ811

Response:

{
    "@context": [
        "https://geojson.org/geojson-ld/geojson-context.jsonld",
        {
            "@version": "1.1",
            "wx": "https://api.weather.gov/ontology#",
            "@vocab": "https://api.weather.gov/ontology#"
        }
    ],
    "type": "FeatureCollection",
    "features": [
        {
            "id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.761f29e725222964fb022293df8e29ec74905de1.001.1",
            "type": "Feature",
            "geometry": null,
            "properties": {
                "@id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.761f29e725222964fb022293df8e29ec74905de1.001.1",
                "@type": "wx:Alert",
                "id": "urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.761f29e725222964fb022293df8e29ec74905de1.001.1",
                "areaDesc": "Cape Thompson to Cape Beaufort out to 15 NM",
                "geocode": {
                    "SAME": [
                        "058811"
                    ],
                    "UGC": [
                        "PKZ811"
                    ]
                },
                "affectedZones": [
                    "https://api.weather.gov/zones/forecast/PKZ811"
                ],
                "references": [],
                "sent": "2025-05-02T03:46:00-08:00",
                "effective": "2025-05-02T03:45:00-08:00",
                "onset": "2025-05-02T03:00:00-08:00",
                "expires": "2025-05-02T18:00:00-08:00",
                "ends": "2025-05-09T17:00:00-08:00",
                "status": "Actual",
                "messageType": "Alert",
                "category": "Met",
                "severity": "Moderate",
                "certainty": "Likely",
                "urgency": "Expected",
                "event": "Gale Warning",
                "sender": "w-nws.webmaster@noaa.gov",
                "senderName": "NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "headline": "Gale Warning issued May 2 at 3:45AM AKDT until May 9 at 5:00PM AKDT by NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "description": "Arctic Alaska Coastal Waters out 100 NM\n\nWind forecasts reflect the predominant speed and direction\nexpected. Sea forecasts represent the average of the highest one-\nthird of the combined wind-wave and swell height.\n\n.TODAY...NE winds 30 kt.\n.TONIGHT...NE winds 35 kt.\n.SAT...NE winds 30 kt.\n.SAT NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt.\n.SUN...NE winds 20 kt.\n.SUN NIGHT...NE winds 20 kt.\n.MON...NE winds 25 kt.\n.TUE...NE winds 20 kt.",
                "instruction": null,
                "response": "Avoid",
                "parameters": {
                    "AWIPSidentifier": [
                        "CWFNSB"
                    ],
                    "WMOidentifier": [
                        "FZAK51 PAFG 021146"
                    ],
                    "NWSheadline": [
                        "GALE WARNING IN EFFECT FROM LATE FRIDAY NIGHT THROUGH EARLY SATURDAY MORNING"
                    ],
                    "BLOCKCHANNEL": [
                        "EAS",
                        "NWEM",
                        "CMAS"
                    ],
                    "VTEC": [
                        "/O.NEW.PAFG.GL.W.1820.250502T1100Z-250510T0100Z/"
                    ],
                    "eventEndingTime": [
                        "2025-05-10T01:00:00+00:00"
                    ]
                }
            }
        },
        {
            "id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.ec11ffedda5425604e13362db74f8951de327863.001.1",
            "type": "Feature",
            "geometry": null,
            "properties": {
                "@id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.ec11ffedda5425604e13362db74f8951de327863.001.1",
                "@type": "wx:Alert",
                "id": "urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.ec11ffedda5425604e13362db74f8951de327863.001.1",
                "areaDesc": "Cape Thompson to Cape Beaufort out to 15 NM",
                "geocode": {
                    "SAME": [
                        "058811"
                    ],
                    "UGC": [
                        "PKZ811"
                    ]
                },
                "affectedZones": [
                    "https://api.weather.gov/zones/forecast/PKZ811"
                ],
                "references": [],
                "sent": "2025-05-01T15:48:00-08:00",
                "effective": "2025-05-01T15:48:00-08:00",
                "onset": "2025-05-01T15:00:00-08:00",
                "expires": "2025-05-02T06:00:00-08:00",
                "ends": "2025-05-02T17:00:00-08:00",
                "status": "Actual",
                "messageType": "Alert",
                "category": "Met",
                "severity": "Moderate",
                "certainty": "Likely",
                "urgency": "Expected",
                "event": "Gale Warning",
                "sender": "w-nws.webmaster@noaa.gov",
                "senderName": "NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "headline": "Gale Warning issued May 1 at 3:48PM AKDT until May 2 at 5:00PM AKDT by NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "description": "Arctic Alaska Coastal Waters out 100 NM\n\nWind forecasts reflect the predominant speed and direction\nexpected. Sea forecasts represent the average of the highest one-\nthird of the combined wind-wave and swell height.\n\n.TONIGHT...NE winds 35 kt.\n.FRI...NE winds 35 kt.\n.FRI NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt.\n.SAT...NE winds 35 kt.\n.SAT NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt.\n.SUN...NE winds 20 kt.\n.SUN NIGHT...NE winds 20 kt.\n.MON...NE winds 25 kt.\n.TUE...N winds 15 kt.",
                "instruction": null,
                "response": "Avoid",
                "parameters": {
                    "AWIPSidentifier": [
                        "CWFNSB"
                    ],
                    "WMOidentifier": [
                        "FZAK51 PAFG 012348"
                    ],
                    "NWSheadline": [
                        "GALE WARNING IN EFFECT FROM EARLY FRIDAY MORNING THROUGH FRIDAY MORNING"
                    ],
                    "BLOCKCHANNEL": [
                        "EAS",
                        "NWEM",
                        "CMAS"
                    ],
                    "VTEC": [
                        "/O.NEW.PAFG.GL.W.9497.250501T2300Z-250503T0100Z/"
                    ],
                    "eventEndingTime": [
                        "2025-05-03T01:00:00+00:00"
                    ]
                }
            }
        },
        {
            "id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.e7e9a62be78d6d0f233a313951977342f60e888e.001.1",
            "type": "Feature",
            "geometry": null,
            "properties": {
                "@id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.e7e9a62be78d6d0f233a313951977342f60e888e.001.1",
                "@type": "wx:Alert",
                "id": "urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.e7e9a62be78d6d0f233a313951977342f60e888e.001.1",
                "areaDesc": "Cape Thompson to Cape Beaufort out to 15 NM",
                "geocode": {
                    "SAME": [
                        "058811"
                    ],
                    "UGC": [
                        "PKZ811"
                    ]
                },
                "affectedZones": [
                    "https://api.weather.gov/zones/forecast/PKZ811"
                ],
                "references": [],
                "sent": "2025-05-01T03:46:00-08:00",
                "effective": "2025-05-01T03:45:00-08:00",
                "onset": "2025-05-01T03:00:00-08:00",
                "expires": "2025-05-01T18:00:00-08:00",
                "ends": "2025-05-02T17:00:00-08:00",
                "status": "Actual",
                "messageType": "Alert",
                "category": "Met",
                "severity": "Moderate",
                "certainty": "Likely",
                "urgency": "Expected",
                "event": "Gale Warning",
                "sender": "w-nws.webmaster@noaa.gov",
                "senderName": "NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "headline": "Gale Warning issued May 1 at 3:45AM AKDT until May 2 at 5:00PM AKDT by NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "description": "Arctic Alaska Coastal Waters out 100 NM\n\nWind forecasts reflect the predominant speed and direction\nexpected. Sea forecasts represent the average of the highest one-\nthird of the combined wind-wave and swell height.\n\n.TODAY...NE winds 35 kt. Blowing snow.\n.TONIGHT...NE winds 35 kt. Blowing snow.\n.FRI...NE winds 35 kt. Blowing snow.\n.FRI NIGHT...NE winds 35 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SAT...NE winds 30 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SAT NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SUN...NE winds 20 kt.\n.MON...NE winds 25 kt.",
                "instruction": null,
                "response": "Avoid",
                "parameters": {
                    "AWIPSidentifier": [
                        "CWFNSB"
                    ],
                    "WMOidentifier": [
                        "FZAK51 PAFG 011146"
                    ],
                    "NWSheadline": [
                        "GALE WARNING IN EFFECT THROUGH EARLY FRIDAY MORNING"
                    ],
                    "BLOCKCHANNEL": [
                        "EAS",
                        "NWEM",
                        "CMAS"
                    ],
                    "VTEC": [
                        "/O.NEW.PAFG.GL.W.9196.250501T1100Z-250503T0100Z/"
                    ],
                    "eventEndingTime": [
                        "2025-05-03T01:00:00+00:00"
                    ]
                }
            }
        },
        {
            "id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.14c5d6e6998688e7e0f6e92c4d5de01f6dd3d51b.001.1",
            "type": "Feature",
            "geometry": null,
            "properties": {
                "@id": "https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.14c5d6e6998688e7e0f6e92c4d5de01f6dd3d51b.001.1",
                "@type": "wx:Alert",
                "id": "urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.14c5d6e6998688e7e0f6e92c4d5de01f6dd3d51b.001.1",
                "areaDesc": "Cape Thompson to Cape Beaufort out to 15 NM",
                "geocode": {
                    "SAME": [
                        "058811"
                    ],
                    "UGC": [
                        "PKZ811"
                    ]
                },
                "affectedZones": [
                    "https://api.weather.gov/zones/forecast/PKZ811"
                ],
                "references": [],
                "sent": "2025-04-25T15:48:00-08:00",
                "effective": "2025-04-25T15:48:00-08:00",
                "onset": "2025-05-02T05:00:00-08:00",
                "expires": "2025-04-26T06:00:00-08:00",
                "ends": "2025-05-03T05:00:00-08:00",
                "status": "Actual",
                "messageType": "Alert",
                "category": "Met",
                "severity": "Moderate",
                "certainty": "Likely",
                "urgency": "Expected",
                "event": "Gale Warning",
                "sender": "w-nws.webmaster@noaa.gov",
                "senderName": "NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "headline": "Gale Warning issued April 25 at 3:48PM AKDT until May 3 at 5:00AM AKDT by NWS Fairbanks AK",
                "description": "Arctic Alaska Coastal Waters out 100 NM\n\nWind forecasts reflect the predominant speed and direction\nexpected. Sea forecasts represent the average of the highest one-\nthird of the combined wind-wave and swell height.\n\n.TONIGHT...NE winds 35 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SAT...NE winds 25 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SAT NIGHT...NE winds 20 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SUN...NE winds 25 kt. Blowing snow.\n.SUN NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt. Blowing snow.\n.MON...NE winds 30 kt. Blowing snow.\n.MON NIGHT...NE winds 30 kt. Blowing snow.\n.TUE...NE winds 30 kt.\n.WED...NE winds 30 kt.",
                "instruction": null,
                "response": "Avoid",
                "parameters": {
                    "AWIPSidentifier": [
                        "CWFNSB"
                    ],
                    "WMOidentifier": [
                        "FZAK51 PAFG 252348"
                    ],
                    "NWSheadline": [
                        "GALE WARNING IN EFFECT THROUGH LATE FRIDAY NIGHT"
                    ],
                    "BLOCKCHANNEL": [
                        "EAS",
                        "NWEM",
                        "CMAS"
                    ],
                    "VTEC": [
                        "/O.NEW.PAFG.GL.W.7078.250502T1300Z-250503T1300Z/"
                    ],
                    "eventEndingTime": [
                        "2025-05-03T13:00:00+00:00"
                    ]
                }
            }
        }
    ],
    "title": "Current watches, warnings, and advisories for PKZ811",
    "updated": "2025-05-02T11:47:23+00:00"
}

[JJKraw]

My experience has been if a given alert ID has hit its expire time but not its end time, an updated alert with a new ID will have been issued. In some cases this doesn't happen, which is a mistake somewhere along the line. Your example seems to be a rather extreme version of this. I'll normally see the new alert pop up within an hour or so.

In any case, I don't display anything that has passed its expire time. Additionally, I check that the status is "Actual" and search for the string "This alert has expired" in the description field (this must have burned me sometime in the past... I don't actually remember what made me add that).

So:

Is this just a data error on NWS's side?

I believe so.

Can expired alerts be returned from an active alert endpoint?

Yes. It happens enough that you need to code for the possibility.

If so, do you treat them as active alerts based on ends field?

In my case, no.

[dwhitemv25]

[white3km]

Are you sure you're looking at the right alert? I'm still getting the 4/26/2025 expires

https://api.weather.gov/alerts/urn:oid:2.49.0.1.840.0.14c5d6e6998688e7e0f6e92c4d5de01f6dd3d51b.001.1

[dwhitemv25]

Oh there is more than one alert in the post, I just looked at the first one. Never mind me.

[JJKraw]

If I do a full pull of PZ zones, I get 205 alerts back and only 78 of them are valid - the rest are expired. Appears to be an issue with cleaning up and/or issuing updated alerts.

[scadergit]

Has this been raised to OMB yet? I would think this level of difference would receive a high priority.

[JJKraw]

I can do so right now.

[JJKraw]

Here's what I got back:

The longstanding issue with Alaska marine alerts is that they do not actually use VTEC so the CAP formatter cannot replace previous alerts with newer ones, thus they all stick around until the original ending time. Recently the marine program has been working with Juneau to test issuing VTEC-enabled marine products, so hopefully that will be improved soon.

[JJKraw]

So, essentially what we're seeing in your example is the followup alerts are being issued but I'm guessing because they don't contain the references, the older ones don't get flushed from the API.

In my case, I'm going to stick with what I've been doing (ignoring anything that has passed its expired time).

[tmabell]

I've had this problem several times and was told that is isn't a mistake. [https://github.com//discussions/782#discussioncomment-11465265]

[scadergit]

This reponse above doesn't imply there won't be other issues. Always report to OMB--they know CAP inside and out and discuss issues with the development team daily.