HV Battery emulation protocol

[diybateriaslifepo4]

Hello, I am the administrator of a Spanish group on LiFePO4 DIY batteries and many other groups such as a specific one for JK BMS, I would like to contact you to talk about the possibility of implementing the Pylontech high voltage CAN protocol, I have the necessary documentation for it.
Thank you very much for our magnificent work.

[Uksa007]

Pylontech high voltage CAN protocol

JK-BMS only support up to 25s which is not high enough voltage for HV applications.

[diybateriaslifepo4]

Yes, that is the inverter that I mentioned, I have one, I think that with the high voltage protocol there would be no problem because they are modular batteries that change voltage according to the modules that are added, it is true that 72V is not a standard voltage of pylontech but I think that will not matter to the inverter, But we won't know if we don't try it, I'm willing to try with mine.

[Uksa007]

What my code does is essentially emulate a know battery that the inverter has support for.
You can't use a battery that has different composition(cell/voltage) than the inverter is expecting.
The inverter will throw an under voltage message and not discharge/change the battery.

There is no supported Pylontech HV battery that has 76.8V nominal, 24s.
https://www.ingeras.es/archive/manuals/ABH2010/IMB09/ABH2010IMB09_G.pdf

Closest would be Force H1: (336V74Ah) 37A max, 2 modules 7kWh, 96V
That would seem to be 30s which is not even close to 24s, (pylontech are normally multiples of 15 cells).

I can't see this working unless you can emulate a supported Pylontech HV battery, of which you need a jk-bms that has 30s, which does not exist.

Edit: Best option I can see would be to use 15s and use Pylontech LV, if you want you could have 2 cells in parallel, eg 2P15S for a total of 30 cells. This solves the problem of needing a jk-bms with more than 15s

[diybateriaslifepo4]

I think that doesn't matter, I think the inverter doesn't care about the voltage if you pass the data correctly, alarms, SOC status, etc etc.
There is another compatible protocol, a completely modular BMS (batrium) that supports from 16 to 100s and is compatible with ingeteam in any voltage range of those supported, no matter if you put 20s or 34s to say an example.

[Uksa007]

I think that doesn't matter, I think the inverter doesn't care about the voltage if you pass the data correctly, alarms, SOC status, etc etc.

The inverter will very much care what voltage the battery is, that's the whole point of CAN communications!
When you select a battery profile, eg pylotech U3000, the inverter knows what the max and min voltages/current are for that battery. If they are out of pre set range the inverter errors and stops discharge/charge. This is not something that can be controlled by pylontech/goodwee protocol.

There is another compatible protocol, a completely modular BMS (batrium) that supports from 16 to 100s and is compatible with ingeteam in any voltage range of those supported, no matter if you put 20s or 34s to say an example

This may be via the native protocol (INGECON Storage) not via Pylontech HV emulation

https://wiki.batrium.com/en/integration

[diybateriaslifepo4]

The inverter will very much care what voltage the battery is, that's the whole point of CAN communications! When you select a battery profile, eg pylotech U3000, the inverter knows what the max and min voltages/current are for that battery. If they are out of pre set range the inverter errors and stops discharge/charge. This is not something that can be controlled by pylontech/goodwee protocol.

But in high voltage batteries the voltage changes according to the number of modules, would it not be possible to send the data that we want and that the inverter considers them valid and works on them?

There is another compatible protocol, a completely modular BMS (batrium) that supports from 16 to 100s and is compatible with ingeteam in any voltage range of those supported, no matter if you put 20s or 34s to say an example

This may be via the native protocol (INGECON Storage) not via Pylontech HV emulation

https://wiki.batrium.com/en/integration

Regarding this if necessary we will have to go that way, Either way the WUE have high voltage inverter we need to develop something for DIY communication.

I understand that if you do not have an hv inverter you will not be very interested in the development of what I comment, you also don't have how to test the system, but there are many people who are, and it would be compatible with many other high voltage inverters (which are the future, because there are more and more models every day).
We will continue to try the development On the other hand, thank you very much for your time and for all the colleagues who make these things possible.

[Uksa007]

But in high voltage batteries the voltage changes according to the number of modules, would it not be possible to send the data that we want and that the inverter considers them valid and works on them?

The number of modules just changes the expected voltage by 48V(15s), you can't tell it you have 1.6 modules which is what you have, to start with the minimum is 2, and increments by 1!
You don't even make the minimum voltage for HV, 2 modules.

Force H1: (336V74Ah) 37A max
2 modules 7kWh, 96V
3 modules 10.5kWh, 144V
4 modules 14kWh, 192V...etc

Regarding this if necessary we will have to go that way, Either way the WUE have high voltage inverter we need to develop something for DIY communication.

No it's not at all necessary, you are just making things harder for yourself.
You have an inverter that is capable to run on LV that will work out of the box with the current JK-BMS and my code.
Yet you seem to want to make things more complex than they need be, based on hopes and dreams.

[diybateriaslifepo4]

We have many colleagues in my group using seplos with 16s LiFePO4 and communicating with pylontec emulation, with victron and deye inverters for example.

[Uksa007]

Victon seems to pretty open and allows you to configure the battery profile, most do not.

When I select I pylontech battery, I get zero options to configure, it is all pre-set in the inverter and not user configurable.

That is why I asked what options do you get when you select a pylontech battery?

[diybateriaslifepo4]

Have you tried to configure a CAN enabled battery, the manual for your inverter just says see the supported battery list. I assume you just get a menu to pick one of the supported batteries, and doesn't allow any configurations?

I am not a programmer or an expert in communication protocols, but from what I've been talking to different colleagues I think the protocol allows you to send the battery configuration information, nominal voltages, charge, discharge, capacity, alarms, etc.

inverter should use the one indicated by the BMS that is the one that knows how the battery is built, maybe don't work well on all inverters, i don't know, but protocol allows it to be done.

[diybateriaslifepo4]

Victon seems to pretty open and allows you to configure the battery profile, most do not.

When I select I pylontech battery, I get zero options to configure, it is all pre-set in the inverter and not user configurable.

That is why I asked what options do you get when you select a pylontech battery?

Which inverter do you use? Are you sure that when you select Pylontech is the inverter who has saved all those parameters and does not read them in the BMS?

[Uksa007]

I think the protocol allows you to send the battery configuration information, nominal voltages, charge, discharge, capacity, alarms, etc.

Thinking it doesn't make it real.

The LV pylontech protocol only allows the BMS to request within the pre set battey profile you pick:
Charge V (if you set it above or below the pre-configured battery profile you select it throws errors.)
Charge max current (if you set it above or below the pre-configured battery profile you select it throws errors.)
Discharge max current (if you set it above or below the pre-configured battery profile you select it throws errors.)
Min discharge voltage (if you set it above or below the pre-configured battery profile you select it throws errors.)
SOC
SOH
Alarms

That's pretty much all you get, you can't send the number of cells, max and min voltages/current configured in the battery profile the inverter has configured.

I suggest you read the protocol for yourself as you have a hard time believing me.
https://solaranzeige.de/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=2373

[zbynekwinkler]

Hello, I am the administrator of a Spanish group on LiFePO4 DIY batteries and many other groups such as a specific one for JK BMS, I would like to contact you to talk about the possibility of implementing the Pylontech high voltage CAN protocol, I have the necessary documentation for it.

I willing to try. According to https://secondlifestorage.com/index.php?threads/high-voltage-hybrid-inverter-gw6000-eh-with-ev-battery-chevy-volt.10300/ Goodwe HV inverters also expect information about number of modules but almost anything can be sent in that message (probably as long as the actual voltage is within the range supported by the inverter) - see https://github.com/yasko-pv/gw-ev/blob/main/CAN_protocol_HV.pdf:

ID 0x453: The number of 48V modules inside the battery. Modules=Nominal voltage / 48
and take integer part of the result. That frame resets timeout counter.

I will have Solax Power HV X3-Hybrid 10.0 T G4 available later this month for testing. It is said to implement Pylontech HV CAN protocol so I could try to make it work. Can you share what documentation you have wrt the protocol?

[Uksa007]

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